efforts are paying off. >> we're going to continue to put every resource we can into our borders to make them safe and secure, to make them truly 21st century borders. but we need immigration reform to go along with this. >> i want to bring in the "national journal's" chris frates and "time's" ana farouk. good morning to both of you. the president's strategy is very methodical. he's line up these groups. let me ask you first, chris, about union. the afl-cio was against immigration reform in 2007. has something changed? >> absolutely. you're starting to see the unions come on board here. and they're starting to signal that bringing all of these undocumented immigrants into the fold, making them legal is going to increase union membership, which has been on decline for many years. and what i'm watching today is this house hearing.

we had last week the big unveiling of the senate gang of eight, we had the framework. and i was talking to marco rubio yesterday, and i said, who's writing the legislation here? who's running point for republicans, who's running point for democrats? and he said, there's not really a system yet. he has a piece he's interested in, he's going to be working on, security, border security, those kind of things, but there's not a system. and in this house hearing, you have a group that has been together for four or five years, we had a big cover story earlier, i guess last year now, in the "national journal," about immigration and this secret group of republicans and democrats who had been meeting and have drafted legislation that they kept in a drawer, because it was so politically unpopular. it was like "fight club." nobody wanted to talk about fight club because they didn't want to run the risk of you talking about these very sensitive issues. they felt like they could move forward on that. the chairman of the house judiciary committee is in that group. >> but how do you get people on the same page? >> i cover this from an economic

perspective, and it's a no-brainer. >> let me ask you about this second group, then. if you read "the wall street journal," you know the names of these ceos who are going to be in today with the president. lloyd blankstein, steve case, marissa mayer. and we're not getting enough visas to highly skilled workers. >> this has been going on for years and years and years, that there's been a shortage of engineers, people with sci-tech backgrounds in the valleys. and this is only going to advance. because industry right now in america is becoming automated, you need a lot more phds, people with deep math backgrounds, and we don't churn enough of those people out in this country. that's a no brainer. but the union deal is very, very interesting. one of the more contentious parts of the debate is the lower end of the spectrum. what do you do about creating a path to legalize immigration for

people who are coming in with lower skill sets. but it's impossible to find a serious piece of economic evidence that low-end immigration is overall bad for the economy. it's good. it's a net -- it's a net positive for the economy. all kinds of immigration. because those folks that are coming in. particularly if they're on a path to legalization, are not doing the same task. they're not going for the same jobs as, say, an american with a high school degree. ultimately, this raises all those, and it's something that the dynamism of our country is based upon. >> and at the same time, the president, as he's done successfully in the past, he's got this idea to win over the public. let me play for you a little part of that big speech he gave in las vegas. >> remember that this is not just a debate about policy. it's about people. it's about men and women. and young people, who want nothing more than the chance to earn their way into the american story. >> there's a new gallup poll out

today, chris. he has a 70% approval rating with hispanics. we know they voted for him by 71%. both sides are doing various things to try to court that vote. the republicans got a real wake-up call in this last election. so in that sense, a very pragmatic sense, is this something that has to get done? >> everyone says that it has to get done, but i'm still not sure it will get done. the president is smart here. he's using his big approval ratings to force lawmakers into seeing things his way. that gets a lot of complaints on the hill, particularly from republicans who say, why don't you come help us legislate something, instead of campaigning all around the country on this. and the devil always, with immigration, is in the details. you talked about high-skill immigration for one. everyone agrees that we should have smarter people here, but that's a carrot in terms of, you know, comprehensive bill. nobody wants to just pass that one piece, because then it gets harder to make a path for citizenship, for everyone else, because that's the harder piece of that. so they don't want to give up

these things that everybody agrees on and pass them piecemeal for things that the people don't agree on will then fall by the wayside. >> the short-termism is really disappointing, because, you know, i was just talking to general electric, as a matter of fact, the other day. they've got a lot of new plants opening up, a lot of developments in silicon valley, and this isn't even a tech firm. they're saying, we need more engineers, need more people with stem backgrounds and we've got to get this done. >> let me bring in congresswoman judy chu, who is part of today's committee hearing. and from california, a state that knows a little bit about immigration, congresswoman, good morning. >> good morning. >> in "the washington post" today, greg sargent points out, "many individual house republicans don't have incentives to back immigration reform, even if opposing it is bad for the gop overall. well over half of house republicans represent districts that are over 80% white and over 200 of them represent districts that back mitt romney." what's your take on where we are on this immigration debate and

are you concerned your republican colleagues won't support any change? >> well, i think the election showed that the american people want immigration reform. certainly, democrats and the president want it. i think the republicans really need it. >> but to the point that he was making, for individual members of congress to be re-elected, they don't feel they have to. >> but if they want the republican party to be able to continue on and not erode, even more, with regard to its overall national base, they really will need to join in to this fight. and also, they need to make sure that this country has the immigrants that it needs to continue forward. for instance, in engineering and technology fields and in the agricultural industry. >> this morning, eric cantor was on some of the shows, and he would not commit to supporting the rubio bipartisan plan. let me read you an excerpt from the speech he's giving today. "we must balance respect for the rule of law and respect for

those waiting to enter this country legally with care for people and families, most of whom just want to make a better life and contribute to america." do you take from that statement some possible movement? >> i feel very encouraged by his statement. and i was so glad that he was part of the eight group of bipartisan senators that came up with a framework. i think this is a great step forward. >> we also saw the pictures a little bit earlier of janet napolitano. she was on the u.s./mexican border. and as you know, there were a lot of republicans who were saying that these changes need to be tied to tougher border security. let me get your take on that and what you think can and should happen. >> well, let me say that more money has been put into border security than all the other federal law enforcement agencies combined. we've had $18 billion for border security, $14 billion for all the rest, fbi, atf, secret security, everything that there is. so we have put quite a bit of money already into this arena.

>> let me ask you finally what you're hoping to get out of this hearing today. >> i hope that we can take a great step forward in making sure that we have this comprehensive immigration bill. i hope this is not just lip service and that this is just a series of hearings. i hope this comes to the conclusion of having a bill that will relieve so many aspiring citizens in this country. >> congresswoman judy chu, thank you so much for being with us. >> thank you. >> there's another topic -- it sounds like you want to react to that, chris. >> one thing, eric cantor, when he goes out today and gives his speech, the thing to remember when he's watching that is that he's not changing republican policy. republican policy remains the same. he's trying to change the tone of republicans to not be as abrasive, to talk about these things in a way that appeals to parents, that appeals to minorities, that appeals to women, these groups that republicans have had a hard time with. so you need to listen to this speech through that frame, and you will see that there's not going to be big shifts in policy

on immigration or some of these other fiscal matters, but rather tone. >> republicans are also making a big deal about president obama missing his budget deadline yesterday. this is the third year in a row. let me play for you what speaker boehner had to say. >> president obama missed a great opportunity today to help our economy. this was supposed to be the day that the president submitted his budget to the congress. but it's not coming. it's going to be late. and some reports say that it could be as long as a month late. i think that's too bad. our economy could use some presidential leadership right now. >> i find a lot of confusion out there with everyday people who come up to me and ask me questions. they don't understand these reports that the senate hasn't passed a budget, now the president's late with the budget. how much does this matter? >> well, not as much as you'd think. look, it's not great. it would have been nice if he would have made the deadline. but frankly, we were discussing this before we came on. there's going to be gridlock around budget issues no matter

what. there's really no policy shift on either side. the fights are as they have been, essentially, since the fiscal cliff issues began months ago. so this is not something to be a game changer in any way. >> well, the president just signed the bill that raises the debt ceiling. so in an age where these fiscal fights are, they're the same, they're ongoing, they can be insecendiary incendiary, we're always talking about a government shutdown of one kind or another, where does this leave us? >> it leaves us with a bunch of people who just fought the first fight, and the senate democrats are going to annapolis today and tomorrow to try to figure out, how do we move forward? how do we move forward with a budget? how do we move forward on funding the government? both of those things need to be done by april 15th. >> because they have taken some hits. and do they really want to give republicans anymore ammunition? >> that's why they've said, we're going to do a budget. and they were happy to sign the increase, meant they had a deadline of april 15th, where they don't get paid, and they have to get a budget done.

>> always a good incentive there. >> so democrats understand that they need that, but this is going to be a partisan document by and large, saying, here's our spending priorities. democrats believe, when they put out their budget, they'll say, this is a balanced approach compared to republicans who want to cut and are taking us down a road of austerity. so even when we have these budgets out, chris, we're not going to see any kind of, oh, well, now there's a plan. >> and i wonder if the conversation changes, because i think a lot of people have been surprised when so much talk about was about the economy and jobs, that really the early part of this year and congress has been dominated by immigration and gun control. not a lot about the economy. >> no, it's interesting. one bit of bright news, frankly, in all of this that the underlying data in the real economy is pretty positive. aside from the fourth quarter, which was a one-off, which that downturn was about cuts and spending. and one-time business inventory issues. thi things are improving. the jobs number was solid,

consumption solid, growth in the housing market and construction. so things are better certainly than they were six months or a year ago. >> chris frates and ranna foroohar, thanks for coming in. a setback for conservatives. ohio's republican governor john kasich now says he wants to dramatically expand medicaid under the new health care law. kasich says he will push to make at least 365,000 low-income ohioans eligible for coverage. he emphasized he is still not supporter of obama care, but believes the expansion makes sense for ohio. >> extending medicaid also means that ohioans will recapture over the next seven years $13 billion in our money to help these working poor and those searching for jobs to be able to get health care in a consistent way. >> the governor will now have to convince skeptical state lawmakers to back the plan that he himself criticized just months ago.

in the first sign of bipartisan cooperation on gun control in the house, a group of former democratic and republican lawmakers will unveil a bill today that would make gun trafficking a federal crime. >> we keep hearing folks say they want -- everybody agrees, criminals should not have guns. well, this is a way to make sure that does not happen. >> the bill mirrors a bipartisan senate proposal unveiled last week as well as legislative proposals that were recently introduced by the president. joining me now, longtime new york congressman, charles rangel. always good to see you, congressman. good morning. >> good to be with you, chris. >> the gun trafficking prevention act of 2013 would impose new penalties against what they call straw purchasers, people who knowingly buy

firearms for convicted criminals who are barred from buying their own weapons. what are the chances of this passing? >> i think that's excellent. there's so many pieces of this bill that we do need. it has to be comprehensive. but the whole idea that someone has a criminal intent when they're transferring a firearm to somebody that can't get a firearm, i think that's going to be one of the easiest things to get over. >> so that's an easy one. president obama kicked off his gun control campaign in minneapolis, where he also stressed the need for universal background checks. congressman ringal voiced concerns over that bill. >> if we're going to move some type of universal legislation, connecting gun owners with the guns themselves and the database and all that, i'm going to have some problems with that. >> a recent poll found, and i'm sure you've seen these numbers, an overwhelming number of americans, 92%, favor expanding

background checks, but you hear that there are congressmen who are against it. the nra has been very vocal in its opposition. what are the chances that gets done? >> i think it's very good, because of the nature of what we're talking about. we're talking about a very dangerous weapon, far more serious than getting a car licensed for a dangerous weapon, as sometimes automobiles and trucks are called. so i think that some people don't mind the inconvenience, if you will, if someone wants to have a firearm, put your name down and say who you are and make certain that we at least are prohibiting or preventing or at least trying to prevent people who have mental illness from getting a dangerous weapon. i don't think that's going to be the problem. we're going to have major problems with the culture of people that just like to use gun for recreational purposes and overcoming the need for having an assault weapon to do this, to

have phone numbfun and to hunt . that's going to be a major problem. but the two that you mentioned, chris. we can get over that, whether we're talking about inner cities or whether we're talking about our rural and suburban areas. i think we're coming together on common agreement. >> well, let's talk a little more about the push for a ban on assault weapons and high-capacity ammunition magazines. here's what the president had to say about that. >> we should restore the ban on military-style assault weapons and ten-round limit for magazines. and that deserves a vote in congress, because weapons of war have no place on our streets or in our schools or threatening our law enforcement officers. >> and in fact, over on the senate side, harry reid has said the same thing, even though he has not given it overwhelming support to these ideas. he said they deserve an up and down vote. is that going to happen? and do you give any chance on passing the assault weapons ban

or the limit on the size of magazines? >> i have to be optimistic. there's a thing about being attached to a weapon that automatically is firing and it has nothing to do with sportsmanship. i have been in combat. i have had automatic weapons. sometimes the weapon almost takes you over with the rapid fire that's involved here. it has nothing to do with killing animals, if that's what people want to do. it has nothing to do with sportsmanship. and being able to have these clips that are over ten rounds, you tell me, what fun is it going to be, because people have to change clips. we know why we're doing it. we know a number of people are killed in the process of having to change clips. and so i think that even though there may be an attachment to the automatic feeling of having a weapon, common sense will dictate that there's no need for

americans to have that in order to have fun. >> that does seem to be the president's approach. i mean, he has had some success in getting out there and doing these campaign-style trips, where he goes out and makes his case to the american people. but there is such strong opposition, as you say, by people who like to use guns for support. and, of course, by the nra, and there's been a lot of debate about whether their influence has waned. they certainly show no signs of backing off. how much can the president influence this debate, congressman? >> he can. he can, because a lot of us that have never gone hunting a deeper respect now for people who enjoy this as a sport. and going out to the american people, it's the only way to break down this logjam that we have with party unity. it's time that america put our country above party politics and break out of this line, if that's what the leader wants. so the president is going, saying, do you want to preserve the safety of americans,

democrats, and republicans or do you want to follow the nra, where clearly they're in the business of selling guns and making profits. i think the president's doing a magnificent job. and he's going to have to continue. >> new york congressman charles rangel, always a pleasure to have you on the program. thank you. >> thank you, chris. just moments ago, senator lindsey graham released a statement, asking the obama administration to reconsider nominating chuck hagel for secretary of defense. still, hagel will probably be confirmed. yesterday, senator john mccain said he will not support a filibuster of his former senate colleague and democrats appear to have at least 57 votes to confirm hagel, including two republicans. first kid you ready? [ female announcer ] second kid by their second kid, every mom is an expert and more likely to choose luvs.

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add tagg romney's name to the list of republicans who aren't running for senate in massachusetts. kerry healey and bill weld also both said no. texas governor rick perry is running radio ads in california to try to bring business into his state. >> building a business is tough. but i hear building a business in california is next to impossible. this is texas governor rick perry and i have a message for california businesses. come check out texas. >> and speaking of business, herobuilders.com is taking advantage of this white house photo of president obama shooting skeet. they have completed an action figure, complete with a clay pigeons t-shirt. it is online for $19.95. and in case you missed new jersey governor chris christie on letterman last night. >> i've made jokes about you, not just one or two, not just ongoing, here or there,

intermittent, but -- >> i didn't know this was going to be this long. >> and if you read only one thing this morning, bloomberg news has tracked down one of the world's youngest female billionaires. her story is fascinating. she's only 30. she's been married three times and doesn't have a college degree. it's up on our facebook page at facebook/jansingco. e "likes." m. so, beginning today, my son brock and his whole team will be our new senior social media strategists. any questions? since we make radiator valves wouldn't it be better if we just let fedex help us to expand to new markets? hmm gotta admit that's better than a few "likes." i don't have the door code. who's that? he won a contest online to be ceo for the day. how am i supposed to run a business here without an office?! [ male announcer ] fast, reliable deliveries worldwide. fedex.

he can talk to china, mongolia and all the koreas and he eats velveeta shells and cheese. so who are you calling amateur? liquid gold. eat like that guy you know. starts with arthritis pain and a choice. take tylenol or take aleve, the #1 recommended pain reliever by orthopedic doctors. just two aleve can keep pain away all day. back to the news. in just a couple of hours, house majority leader eric cantor will become the latest republican to try to reshape the gop message. in an address before the american enterprise institute, cantor will argue ways that conservatives can hold on to their message, but use a more pragmatic approach to get it out. >> i think that where we have a lot of room to grow, as a party, as conservatives, is to explain

again why we're for the kind fiscal discipline that we're for. what is the reality and how are we going to help people? >> let's bring in jonathan collegeio, communications director for american crossroads super pac, and democratic strategist and purple strategies co-founder, steve mcmahon. good morning, gentleman. >> good morning. >> by my count, this is the fourth time eric cantor has tried to kind of rebrand the republican party, sort of switch gears on messaging. he is expected to tout new education initiatives, ways to simplify the tax code, kush health care costs, immigration reform. ron fournier with the "national journal," jonathan, asked this question -- "with a democratic tide threatening to crush the dpop, is it enough to just tweak talking points?" what do you say to that question? >> i think there's a tendency among policy maker, politicians who are in the legislative chamber all day, to be using

this policy. they talk about the fiscal cliff, about entitlement reform, about debalancing the budget. but it's devoid of any value to the average voter. so fournier may have a point there, but i think it's critical for republicans to be talking about the values behind these policies, that we're always promoting. fiscal responsibility, why are we doing that? because that's a path to prosperity. i think that's a critical thing that eric cantor is doing today and i applaud him for doing it. >> that is what he does seem to be wanting to talk about, connecting the dots. and steve, he isn't just talking about -- you know, he isn't talking at all about moderating. he's talking about this change of tone. and i wonder if the message, reducing the debt and deficit, fixing the education system for the most vulnerable is the way he puts it. the way he talks about immigration, are those things that will resonate? >> i think jonathan's right. what the republican party used to stand for, when george h.w. bush was president, is something that the republican party doesn't seem to stand for for most americans anymore. what they seem to stand for

today is being, you know, insensitive on immigration. and not being mindful of a woman's -- you know, women's rights and there are symbols that the republican party promotes, like, they say they're for education, but they want to abolish the department of education. and i think that makes it difficult for them to cut through. if eric cantor can do it, then it needs to be done. but i'm just -- i think that there are candidates out there every single cycle that get in the way of the republicans try to rebrand and they are back in this same position every two years. >> eric cantor is not alone, for sure, jonathan, your old boss, or i guess your boss, karl rove, as how often talked about trying to fix the image and he's angered a lot of republicans, especially far right conservatives by talking about his plans to go against the most extreme in the primary. mark levin, the talk show host, says conservatives are being stabbed in the back. erick erickson, the editor of redstate.com says the efforts

will, quote, crush conservatives, destroy the tea party, and put a bunch of squishes in republican leadership positions. what's your response to that? >> i tend to think that's kind of alarmism. we haven't really proposed any policy changes or anything like that, at least from the crossroads group. whenever you come about this type of thing, you have to look at it in terms of policy. you have to look at it in terms of style and the rhetoric you're using. and then for a lot of communities, if you're trying to go after the african-american vote, the hispanic vote, or the asian vote, you have to be willing to show up and you have to be willing to do that consistently. there are three legs to that stool and you have to be doing them all. we're not advocating any differences on policy, but it is, i believe, important that we need to be changing our rhetoric a little bit, and be promoting values. when we talk about balancing the budget or the fiscal cliff, the average person in peoria, illinois, isn't connecting on the same level. we need to be talking about what value is that for them? and the value for that is, if we get the nation's fiscal house in order, that means that business will thrive and there'll be more prosperity. those are the types of things we need to talk about.

>> steve, is there an opportunity for democrats in the middle of all of this, when you see some of the more moderating republicans really taking aim at tea partyers, taking aim at the far right, and recognizing some of the problems they've caused by nominating some of these candidates that are not able to win in general election. >> well, there's always an opportunity for democrats, when the republicans are attacking their base. and when it takes moderate republicans to pass even common sense reforms. so, for instance, the reason we didn't go over the fiscal cliff had nothing to do with the tea party members, who wanted to go over. it had to do with responsible, moderate republicans, who understand that taking the country into recession wasn't a good idea. and i think as you watch this civil war play out. and i think the crossroads folks who are out there saying, web need to nominate republicans who can actually win a general election are right, but they're doing so at the expense of their base, which is going to create huge problems for them. the base isn't going to shut up and go away. they'll continue to run in and

win primaries. and they're going to continue to produce nominees that can't win, like richard mourdock and the witch in delaware and others who the republican party should be afraid of. >> steve mcmahon, jonathan collegeio, thanks to both of you. >> thank you. we have a developing story i want to tell you about, the associated press reporting that the president will ask congress to put off the sequester. those, of course, those harsh automatic cuts scheduled to kick in march 1st. according to white house sources, the president will make a public statement this afternoon. instead of the sequester, he will ask for other cuts to reduce the deficit in the short-term, perhaps for several months. also making news this morning, the alabama boy rescued from a kidnapper in an underground bunker is said to be doing well this morning. police say that ethan is doing all the things you'd expect a normal 5-year-old to do. officers stormed that bunker yesterday after they snuck in a camera and determined the boy was in danger. when police got down there, they found the suspect, jimmy lee

dykes, dead. it was a dramatic end to a 143-hour standoff. the iraq war veteran charged with killing a former navy s.e.a.l. sniper had spent time in a mental hospital twice over the past five months. police say eddie ray ralph told them he was suffering from posttraumatic stress disorder. the victim, chris kyle, had reached out to ralph for taking him to a shooting range over the weekend. pakistan is planning an amusement park in the town where osama bin laden spent his final hours. the $30 million park and outdoor recreation center in abadbad will take about five years to bill. we'll talk about what michelle obama can do to make an impact in the next four years. that is coming up in less than ten minutes on "jansing and co."

a top rating agency is in the government's crosshairs for its role in the 2008 financial crisis. cnbc's mandy drury is here with what's moving your money. mandy, a lawsuit against standard & poor's has been filed. what's that about? >> they're suggesting that s&p ignored their own standards to raise mortgage bonds that imploded in the financial crisis. we know the story well. and at the end of the day, it really cost investors billions of dollars and wreaked a lot of havoc. the civil charges by the u.s. attorney general, eric holder, are the first action against a credit rating firm over the crisis, but s&p said it came out with a statement yesterday and said the government suit is entirely without factual or legal merit and it also denied wrongdoing. so we're just going to have to see how this story unfolds from here, chris. >> and what is going on with gas prices? i was in california overing the weekend, a little sticker shock there. but it's certainly not just there. most expensive ever for this time of year. >> ever, ever. the current average is $3.53 a gallon. that is, of course, the average

nationwide. that is up 23 cents from a month ago, and this time last year, prices were $3.48 a gallon. how much do you spend on gas? well, the average household, apparently, spent about $2,900 to fill up their tank last year participate and that is the most expensive in 30 years. it could take out 2008. it also equates to just under 4% of your income. that is, obviously, for the average household, before taxes and that really brings it home, when you talk about it in those terms. i guess people are wondering, you know, why the sudden jump? apparently, we have a number of refineries down in a number of locations. crude oil prices are rising. and we've also had a supply shortage in california. so inventories are being devoted from elsewhere in the country to help out with that as well. so a number of factors pushing up these gas prices. chris, let's see if they come down. >> yeah, exactly. cnbc's mandy drury, good to see you, mandy >> see ya. if you think your commute is bad and you're wasting a lot of

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particles can emit from a patient, measuring the amount in a patient's system and in the air around them, researchers found that the virus can spread up to 6 feet away, much farther than previously thought. a high school football coach has now been suspended for unkind remarks he made to a student about the first lady's efforts to promote low-calorie lunches. >> like those lunches, you get 600 calorie lunches, you know who's behind that? >> michelle obama. >> fat butt michelle obama. and look at her. she looks like she weighs 185 or 190. she's overweight. >> well, the school board will meet later this month to decide the fate of bob grisham, but in the meantime, pretty much no first lady has escaped criticism. hillary clinton took ridiculous shots over her ankles and her hair. but michelle obama is having the last laugh. her approval rating now at 73%, higher than her husband and all other members of his cabinet.

so as she begins another four years in the white house, how will she use that goodwill in a second term? i'm joined now by ivillage correspondent kelly wallace and marie goldman. so she's done the let's move campaign, which is what that idiot was referring to. and also, she's really embraced organizations like walmart, that agreed to hire veterans. but those are considered safe. does she have an opportunity here, do you think? >> well, you know, she knows she has an opportunity. she knows it's a very big platform. she has another four years, but you talk to aides. they say she is definitely going to continue on, let's move, kind of deepen and expand her involvement on that issue. also joining forces, where she talks about helping and supporting military families. but they say that she is considering picking up another issue. and they also say she is so disciplined and strategic, chris, they're not just looking at the next six months or year, they're planning for the next four years. they're doing a whole strategic planning process for the next four years.

they're definitely considering picking up something else. >> there are people who will criticize her and have criticized her, and a lot are self-described feminist, because they don't like the way she's described herself, which is mom in chief. that i can a listen to this. >> you see, at the end of the day, my most important title is still mom in chief. >> they find that retro, they think that she should be bolder. what about that? >> you know, what's lost often in the story of michelle obama is that this was a former career woman. she had a very high-profile career as a hospital administrator. she's a trained lawyer. we don't often hear about that when we talk about michelle obama. there is a contingent of women who say that she should be more active. but at the same time, she has built up an enormous of goodwill capital that she could use for another platform. so it's a wait and see kind of thing. this is a low-risk kind of personality. i think she's a first lady on

bar with a jackie-o./laura bush type, when they call a velvet glove ambassador to issues. she's not a hillary clinton. >> i think she would take some issue, too, with some of the criticism. something she's said in some interviews we've done along the way is women fought for choices, right? we fought for the choices to do what we want to do when we want to do them. when she came to the white house, number one priority was making sure that malia and sasha were going to transition and be okay. and i think as women, we want to applaud other women for making the decisions that they make. if they think right now that family at the start of the administration was paramount, that's what she's doing. >> and i'm sure you've found, as i have, every first lady that i've ever interviewed, who has a child that they're bringing into the white house, i remember having conversations with laura bush about this, how can you criticize them for understanding that they are in a situation that is so unique, that is so in the spotlight, that presents so much opportunity, but also so much potential downfall.

i remember when there were some reports about the bush girls and some things that they did, and you know, laura bush really pushed back against that. you know, what mom -- wouldn't you irresponsible not to make that a top priority? >> well, of course. yet, this is a woman with enormous resources at her disposal. wom a woman who is an intellectual. she's brought performers and thinkers and historians into the white house. she, not her house. so thshe is a deep person with agenda of her own. i think there's a hunger to see a little bit more of it. >> i wonder if one of the things -- and i read a lot about this and her critics and the people who wished she would get involved, and i'm sure she has a million requests that come into her office every day. but one of the more interesting things was gun control because of the issue in newtown and because of the children. but, boy, what a politically charged area that would be. >> it is. and you know, you do think she's probably seen and taken a page from previous first ladies, in

particular, hillary clinton. the public, you know, we like the public, i would think, all three of us at this table would be more supportive of people out there on the policy level, as well as doing some of the other issues that first ladies often do. but the public is not that accepting of that. she obviously came out with a letter to the families of the newtown victims. she's going to support her husband, in terms of the organizing for america initiative, to try to get communities to rally around the president's initiatives. she's going to be supporting that agenda, but i think she's going to be using her personal and political capital a little bit more on some of these other issues that may sometimes seem apolitical. >> real quickly, yes or no, do you ever see her running for office? >> no. >> you know, she says, no, no, no, no, but she is so amazing out on that campaign trail, you have to wonder if she's going to say, five years from now, i'm pretty good, why don't i give it a shot? i was in the ambulance

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democrats and republicans are already crafting their midterm battle plans, which includes redistricting or gerrymandering. that contorts districts to favor one party over another. republicans in some states are also talking about changes the way we elect the president. they would award electoral votes by congressional district, instead of winner takes all to the candidate who carries the state. richard lui is here with the drilldown, and richard, you found out that gerrymandering had an enormous impact on the last election. >> chris, democratic congressional candidates got at least 1.4 million more votes than republicans nationwide, but then only won 33 fewer seats. why? because border lines that have been revised over two years to look like this one in florida. all the way from orlando to

jacksonville is how far this district goes. and we've got north carolina. that's another example. it looks amoeba, like? not a square, not a circle, but a carefully carved congressional district to favor one party. it goes through about a dozen cities. state houses across the country with republicans and majorities are daying election district lines like that so get more republicans to congress than they would otherwise. those gerrymandering tactics include packing, putting voters who support your opponent into other districts opponents will already win, and cracking, in close races, moving voters who might vote for your opponent out of your district. now, gerrymandering has helped republicans in virginia gain eight seats in congress to the democrats' three, despite votes for republican candidates being only 70,000 more. swing state, ohio, 12 seats for republicans and 4 for democrats. democrats do this, too. in illinois, 54% of the popular

vote went to democrats, but they won 66% of the house seats. maryland, democrats with 62% of the popular vote, but 88% of the seats. all said, in 2012, republicans are outdid democrats by a net seven seats, according to princeton researcher sam wang. now, this disenfranchisement means each republican vote in states like ohio and virginia is equal to 2 1/2 votes, democratic votes. also in illinois and maryland, up to three republican votes equal one democratic vote. now, chris, that is the math the founding fathers did not intend, what i just showed you there. redistricting to them was to ensure a true people's house. >> and they get redrawn again in 2020. where did this term, gerrymandering come from? >> you'll find this interesting. gerrymandering celebrated its 200th anniversary just last year. the boston gazette used it to describe what the massachusetts governor at time was trying to

do. his name was elbridge engineger benefit his district, and it looked like a salamander he drew it out, put that together, you get gerrymander. >> that wraps up this hour. all. ok. [ voice of dennis ] silence. are you in good hands?

big time taste should fit in a little time cup. new single serve cafe collections from maxwell house now available for use in the keurig k-cup brewer. always good to the last drop. hi, everyone. good morning. i'm thomas roberts. topping our agenda, immigration and guns. live at the capitol this hour, the house committee debating the road ahead for immigration reform and a path to citizenship for 11 million people. house speaker john boehner saying this in the last hour. >> this is not about being in a hurry, this is about trying to get it right, on behalf of the american people and those who are suffering under an immigration system that doesn't work very well for anybody. >> meanwhile, at the same time, the